Alan Payling questions why some tour drivers end up with itineraries that are totally unsuitable or very difficult for full-size coaches when they visit South Devon and offers some light hearted, though serious advice on places and pitfalls to avoid
“Hello, Alan Payling, can I help you?”
“Yes, I’m a coach driver. Can I pick your brain about a place on my itinerary?”
“Sure, go ahead.”
“Can I get to a place called Grimes Pond with a coach?”
“Where?’”
“Grimes Pond.”
“You don’t mean Grimspound do you? On Dartmoor?”
“Yeah, that’s it.”
“Then no, you can’t.”
“Oh dear, the group organiser won’t be very happy. Cheers Alan.”
I get a few of these sorts of calls. Mainly, it appears, when a group organiser is involved. Most of the time, when operators are running their own tours, they organise visits to the familiar and easily accessible cities, towns and resorts in this part of the world. However, when a group organiser rolls up, they want to visit the obscure, the difficult or the inaccessible places that Devon is full of. I sometimes wonder how such places end up on a driver’s itinerary.[wlm_nonmember][…]
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It strikes me, and this is pure speculation, of course, that a group organiser books a coach and tells the operator where they want to go. Is it the case that the group organiser believes that because the operator accepts their booking that the places they want to visit are suitable for a coach? I also wonder that in turn, because the group organiser sounds like they know what they’re talking about, that the operator assumes it is they who have checked that the obscure place they want to visit is suitable for a coach? Are the blind leading the blind here?
Anyway, but with no further ado, the booking is agreed, the itinerary prepared, and it then ends up in the driver’s lap. The driver considers where they’re being asked to take their coach, scratches their head a bit, and then has a look on Google Earth to discover that it looks a bit iffy. Then they phone me. After a sharp intake of breath, I give them the bad news as politely as I can. This leaves the driver having to convey to the group that no, the place they have travelled all the way to Devon to see is not accessible or just difficult to get to. The driver worries that this will make him/her look unhelpful, uncooperative or just plain awkward. The result? Disappointed passengers, the driver’s attitude being unfairly questioned and the reputation of the operator taking a knock. The only consolation is that because it was the driver that had the sense to ask a few pertinent questions, the coach is intact and undamaged and the passengers are safe.
Because I get a few such requests for help with itineraries, I have included below a few of the surprising places that drivers have found on their itineraries. I have graded them accordingly, so hopefully, when a group organiser appears asking for mission impossible in South Devon, more people will know what is, and what isn’t, do-able in this part of the world.
Definitely not, or, you must be joking!
Grimspound
Let’s start with Grimspound, a bronze age settlement just off a lane that runs from the B3212 Moretonhampstead/Princetown road down to Widecombe. Initially the single track lane starts on the high open moorland, so the lack of hedges is deceptive. Once you have found where to drop your group – an OS map and a compass would be useful here – you will start to think about turning round. So you keep going. The only places that offer anything remotely like a turning point have deep ruts in the peat adjacent to the tarmac: axle deep ruts. Dartmoor is very soft. It is when you drive 14 tonnes over it.
So you keep going and eventually drop down to where you hit stone wall country. Well, they either hit you or you hit them: depends what you put in the accident report, I suppose. You are now in squeaky bottom country, the sort of place that all coach drivers have nightmares about, the sort of nightmares where the lane you are on gets narrower and narrower, only now you are not dreaming! Welcome to Dartmoor, driver!
The reason for going to Grimspound was because the driver had a group of archaeologists on board. In deciding whether to follow my advice and the advice of the Coach Drivers Handbook published by the Dartmoor National Park Authority that this lane was not coach friendly, the driver was between a rock and a hard place – and some of the rocks on Dartmoor are indeed very hard. He had to ask: “Do I dig myself into a hole, or, disappoint the passengers?” He wisely chose the latter. Wreckers are expensive.
l Advice: When going anywhere on Dartmoor, if the map referred to above indicates that a road is not suitable for coaches, the authority really does know what it’s talking about. If you ignore that advice, the best case scenario is that you will have to reverse out. That could be for miles. The worst case is a wrecker. Trust me – please.
Cockington Village
You might imagine that the whole of the coach trade would know by now that you can’t take a coach into Cockington Village, yet it keeps on making frequent guest appearances on a surprising number of itineraries. PSVs are banned – but see below. In case someone tells you that there is in fact a coach drop-off point in Herbert Road for coach parties visiting Cockington, while they would be right, it is not suitable for coach passengers with limited mobility. Cockington sits in a valley. The drop-off is above Cockington on the edge of the valley. This means a walk down a narrow, dark lane and a walk back up. For the older market, this is not an option. If you do try it, have an ambulance standing by.
Advice: Your passengers can get to Cockington on the number 62 bus which is allowed into Cockington. The Torquay land train also runs to Cockington on certain days from Belgrave Road first thing and then from Torquay harbour.
Castle Drogo
This is a pretty impressive building which sits off the A382 Mortonhampstead/Whiddon Down/Okehampton Road. This is a tricky place to get to due to narrow lanes and tight bends. The National Trust’s advice is that no vehicle larger than 2.39m wide and 10.5m long or with more than 43 seats can access the site so your passengers will be very disappointed if no one checked access beforehand.
Advice: Listen to the National Trust (NT). I imagine that their advice is based on someone’s very costly experience. While you are talking to the NT, find out quickly about alternative NT sites in the area that are accessible by full-size coach to keep your passengers happy.
Greenway
This is the former home of Agatha Christie overlooking the river Dart, the authoress you will recall of a succession of successful crime whodunits. ‘Whodidn’tdoit’ will be the question on your passengers’ lips when they find out that someone should have checked that you can’t get there in a full-size coach. It doesn’t really need the detective skills of Miss Marple or Monsieur Hercule Poirot to discover that had you gone in a 35-seater midi coach, and booked in advance, all would have been well. When the passengers find out ‘whodidn’tdoit’ properly, there might be a murder mystery night back at the hotel!
Advice: Call the National Trust and they will supply details of alternative forms of transport to access Greenway. You can go by ferry from Dartmouth and by steam train from Paignton or Kingswear. However, Greenway sits on a hill. The steam train and the boat drop passengers at the bottom. If you go by ferry, there is a steep 10-minute walk but for disabled passengers, Greenway can send a car. If you go by train, then you can catch a bus up the hill from Greenway Halt.
Yes, but do you feel lucky, well do you?
In this section, best advice is to ensure your coach is fitted with a good reversing camera and do you really have to send your brand new coach?
Morwellham Quay
This is a Victorian copper mine and port on the river Tamar from where the valuable ore was shipped to the world. Access on the face of it is good. The problem comes when you turn off the A390 Tavistock to Callington road and you start looking for signs. Usually, they are hidden by overgrown bushes and trees.
Advice: Make sure your driver has a pair of garden shears with them. If they haven’t got long arms, go in autumn. Alternatively, because there are some tricky places round here, check Google Street View and the map carefully so you know exactly where you’re going. If it then looks like you’re going rapidly downhill on a very heavily wooded road and you end up in a dead end by the river Tamar, this time, you’re actually on the right road.
Salcombe
On the face of it this is a very appealing destination. However, if there was a competition for the most coach unfriendly destination, my nomination would go to Salcombe. The signage for coaches is poor, badly sited and easily missed, the drop-off point is non-existent and the parking nicely situated where turning around is either difficult or impossible. If you miss the direction signs for coaches you end up in a coach dead end from which there is only one way out: to reverse, uphill. The Park & Ride is not that regular so most of the year you have to drive into the town.
I spoke to a lady in the local tourist information office a few years ago who told me: “Ohhhh, Salcombe doesn’t really do coaches, darling.” I think that’s what she said: either the plum in her mouth or her stiff upper lip made it difficult to clearly understand her. The reason for her disdain was that Salcombe caters for the sailing crowd. If you have a coach load of people who own yachts, then fine, but I don’t think it’s a big market – they normally go by Range Rover: big ones.
Advice: If you must, but don’t expect your passengers to enjoy the walk to the shops/cafes or the prices some charge.
Chagford
When a driver called me to find out if Chagford was suitable for his coach, my reactions were variously: “Really?”, “Whose idea was that?”, “That’s novel” and “Is someone having a laugh?” What I actually said was: “Have you got that right?” Because Castle Drogo is close by, I thought that perhaps that vital bit of information had been left off. No, Chagford it was.
I pointed out that yes, on a good day, when you get off the A382 Moretonhampstead/Okehampton road and the road to the village centre forks left, follow it into the square. Hopefully, you will be able to turn around and follow the road on the right of the square back to the main road. As to where you will park, the best I could suggest was to go back to Moretonhampstead, though it is not convenient. Oh, and he was driving a 14.5m coach, just to make life really interesting. The next question was: “What’s there?” Well, it’s a nice town but one of its claims to fame is that it has got two really great hardware stores that have been in the same family for years. Yes, really. Have a look at Chagford’s Wikipedia page – they really must do a lot of DIY in Chagford. There’s not much else to do.
Advice: On a bad day, badly parked cars or delivery vans will make life very difficult. Also, they have just had the blue moon when the coach above visited: they’re not expecting another one for quite a while.
Shaldon
I’ve put this is the ‘Yes’ category because there are in fact coach bays above Shaldon, but the possibility of getting stuck in the village below is without doubt. The coach bays are accessible on the right as you go down the hill on the A379 Torquay to Shaldon/Teignmouth Road. Entering the village from the bottom end just before or just after you have crossed the river bridge should not ever be attempted. I’m surprised there aren’t prohibition signs there. The village is narrow and at the other end the road is just too tight to contemplate.
In theory, you could drop your passengers at the coach bays and they could walk down. They would then have to walk back up the hill and it is a good walk. When they do get into Shaldon, they will find a very, very quiet picturesque village: even the local newsagent has closed as this is holiday cottage land. That’s why it’s quiet.
Advice: Don’t bother – keep going to Teignmouth or Dawlish.
The Garden House, Buckland Monachorum
It will be a gardening group that will want to go here. Located north of Plymouth, once you turn off the A386 Plymouth/Tavistock road, you will come to the village of Crapstone. The people of this appropriately named village park their cars on the main lane through here. This is the lane you have to use. At one point, even cars have to take care to get through. A really badly parked car an inch too far into the lane means that coaches will take their chances with the hedges and stone walls on the other side of the road. The gate into the Garden House is tricky and catches people out. There is another road round Crapstone but unless you are going by tractor, take a chainsaw to clear the very low hanging trees.
Advice: Persuade the gardeners that RHS Rosemoor is a much better option. It takes a similar time to get there, the roads are good via the A30 and the gardens are stunning.
Other tricky places
Coleton Fishacre south of Brixham accepts coaches, but be sure to book in advance with the National Trust as their information indicates they only have space for one coach. If you are then going to Dartmouth, do not turn left at the main road – that will take you to the lower ferry which does not take coaches. Turn right and go back to the roundabout and take a left there for the higher ferry unless you have a dodgy ferry lift or a tri-axle. If you have either, call it a day. You are not going on the ferry.
Compton Castle is at the back end of Paignton on the Marldon/Ipplepen lane. As many drivers will be staying in Torquay and Paignton they naturally think that going from the Marldon end is going to be okay. Wrong. It is not a coach friendly road and neither are the locals if they find you down there. This is rat run country.
The NT’s advice is to go to Newton Abbot, head to Totnes on the A381 and then turn towards Compton Castle at Ipplepen. There is just about enough space to pull in to avoid blocking the lane when you drop off and you can then park 30 yards away.
South West Coast Path: As some retired people are hale and hearty, they like to go rambling. One group tried to persuade their driver to turn off the A379 Torquay/Teignmouth Road into the lanes running down to the sea so they could be dropped near to the coastal path. He didn’t, thankfully. Best advice is to drop them either in the coach bays at Shaldon or on Babbacombe Downs, and let them walk from there.
Slapton: The WW2 Sherman tank which is a legacy of the disastrous Operation Tiger on Slapton Sands in 1944 is still a draw. But the road down there, whether you go from Dartmouth or Kingsbridge, is very challenging as the locality gets ever more popular with tourists in 4x4s. Best advice is to time your trip to follow one of the double-decker buses that serve this area. Meeting one head on in the wrong place is not for the faint hearted. If you meet one, serve teas and coffees. You will have time, lots of time.
Widecombe-in-the-Moor is visited by many coach parties safely and easily throughout the year because drivers don’t use sat navs to get there. They travel from Bovey Tracey and go out the same way even if they are heading for Princetown which is indeed the long way round. Beware anyone who tells you that if you are going to Princetown you can cut across to Postbridge.
Please don’t. One driver said that a local school bus driver told him this was a good idea. Look at the local school buses before you follow his advice. Also, legend has it that Dartmoor’s little people, the pixies, are still trying to lead people astray!
Finally, for those of you that come down here with a private group and they want to go somewhere that you have never heard of, there might be a very good reason for that. I’ve given you a few above. So be warned. And when in doubt, you can always say: “Can I pick your brain Alan?” I can’t wait to hear where you’re going next! I love a laugh! [/wlm_ismember]
